Direct Debit integration (UK) requirements and specification

I'm just trying to clarify terminology here. Does direct debit integration mean a) making an immediately processed transaction on a debit card that, for example, withdraws money from a chequing account and deposits it in the organization's bank account before the thank you page is displayed to the CiviCRM user? If so, then the abstracted part is more about the difference between the fields for a credit card versus the bank account number (in Canada that's the institution or bank number, the transit or branch number, and the account number itself), and the processing will follow the same general lines as the existing code that handles credit cards through payment processors. Or does direct debit integration mean what people here sometimes talk about as pre-authorized payments? In this, there is a direct debit made from the constituent's bank account that is credited to the organization's bank account. Many non-profits here make periodic, usually monthly, uploads of files containing a batch of debits to made of various amounts from various bank accounts. Perhaps you mean both ideas or something else again?

In Canada the API interfaces for the first are very similar to those for credit card processing. The later are very different, requiring Header and Footer records for the file, and providing results in a downloadable file or two. As the transfers may take days to clear just like a paper cheque, the results aren't known instantaneously.

(Apologies for not wading through the site to find out which is which - they seemed to be talking about the system for collecting and storing bank account information, which according to the Payment Card Industry Data Security Standard (https://www.pcisecuritystandards.org/security_standards/ ) is information that does not need to be encrypted, in contrast to Credit Card information.)

Put another way, is there overlap between SmartDebit support and ACH (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_Clearing_House ) in the US, which implements the second approach that is also common amongst Canadian non-profits? I'm interested in collaborating on an ACH implementation.

Finally, do you have financial goal based on the estimate of work yet?

I'm not familiar with the various systems in use around the world.  I'll try and clarify what happens with a UK direct debit.

a direct debit MANDATE is the permission for an organistion to take money from a client bank account.  This normally happens on a regular basis.  It can be for a fixed or variable amount.  Setting up the mandate is seperate from actually making any payments.  i.e. take X fixed/variable amount from my account every Y days/months/years starting from date Z until further notice.

To set up the mandate, the client needs to give the organisation their bank account number and sort code (branch code).

Then the organisation (normally on a regular basis) asks their direct debit provider to process all the PAYMENTS.  Once this has been done, the direct debit provider reports on success / failure direct for each mandate.

We'd be very happy to come in on this and meet a proportion of the costs. It would be a  useful tool for us which we have been wanting to see for some time. The best example I have seen is the one Michael showed me  - https://www.concern.net/en/donate/regular/new?amount= . 

It would be very helpful if the existing CiviCRM data on an individual were automatically filled in the form (name, address etc.).

I hope I get a chance to meet you, Eileen, when you are here.

Simon

Is it practical for the scope of this project, to make the architecture open to plugging in country-specific gateways? Such as being able to plugin a North American ACH gateway?  It will be easier to get donations to fund this project if there is a benefit (down the road) to US and Canadian nonprofts.

Has anyone investigated the approach for ACH direct debit taken by the module at:  http://drupal.org/sandbox/johnbarclay/1215340   This works with the APIs for a comany called "IPAY" (http://www.ipay.com/ )

Hi All
We have been involved in Direct Debit for over 20 years with our flagship CRM products and have created a CiviCRM module which carried out the Direct Debit process. We'd be happy to walkthrough this module if needed and can contribute back if needed also.
Let us know!
Thanks
Parvez
NFPServices
Hi All

We have been involved in Direct Debit for over 20 years with our flagship CRM products and have created a CiviCRM module which carried out the Direct Debit process. We'd be happy to walkthrough this module if needed and can contribute back if needed also.

Our module will produce the relevant lodgements file to send to the relevant BACS software.

We have also done integration with a Direct Debit bureau where the direct debit mandates are held by the third party and not within CiviCRM.

Let us know how we can help.

Thanks

Parvez

NFPServices

Hello, 

the requirements for UK DD are not the same as Debit Card (which is authorised prior to settlement). UK DDs are operated through BACS and they publish very specific scheme rules for electronic submitters. There are standardised messages for signing up new customers (called AUDDIS - Direct Debit Instruction), sending payment files (both Debit and Credit are possible under the scheme), receiving lists of failed Direct Debits (ARUDDs) and receiving lists of amendments and cancellations (ADACS). All of these messages are available electronically (definitions are XML) however most submitters either operate through a bureau (there are dozens to choose from) or licence their own BACSTEL-IP software from an approved supplier. If you go this route you have to go through a (reasonably thorough) accreditation process. 

By the way if you sign up DD customers online (so called paperless DD) you need to pass separate accreditation, and your system needs to validate sort code and account numbers for validity. There are a number of third parties (Experian is one) that you can off-load this validation to; building your own database of valid sort codes and check digit rules is probably a step too far for an open-source project although I admire your ambition if you do attempt it. 

DD capability will be a hugely useful add-on and I can offer some time and guidance to your project if you need it. I've implemented UK DD at several clients over the years.

David